Stack and Tilt: Fool's Gold?
Filed in archive Golf Instruction on May 12, 2007
Bennett (l), Plummer (r) with Baddeley
Courtesy: golf digest
Have you heard about The New Tour Swing? It's the product of a couple of teaching pros based in Philadelphia who are making some big waves on the PGA Tour.
Mike Bennett and Andy Plummer have a growing coterie of touring pros who they are instructing.
The list includes two big names in Aaron Baddeley and Canadian Mike Weir, former Masters winner.
When teachers pick up top names, everyone starts to pay attention.
So what is this New Tour Swing?
Golf Digest has several excellent short video samples on their website, demonstrating, by the way the right way to use video on the web (if you can stomach the "must-watch" commercial pre-roll).
But back to the Swing. As Golf Digest's Senior Editor, Peter Finch, describes it, Bennett and Plummer call their swing, Stack and Tilt.
Finch complained that his iron shots lacked power and distance. So Bennett and Plummer taught him their new swing.
And it appears to violate many of the principles considered critical to a proper swing.
For example, Bennett and Plummer instructed Finch to put most of his weight on his left side at address.
On the backswing, they told Finch to move his left shoulder down, not laterally.
The body, they say, remains over the ball. This surely takes away the weight shift that virtually every teacher claims is one of the keys to power and distance.
The club comes decidedly inside on the backswing; the turning body, say Plummer and Bennett, creates an inside path; the backswing itself is shorter to keep arms and torso connected.
The result is a swing that is compact in appearance, to say the least. In fact, it looks condensed or compressed or maybe just choppy.
There is a short video of Aaron Baddeley hitting balls with the new swing. I can't recall what his old swing looked like but his new one is no thing of beauty.
But if it gets the job done (Baddeley has won twice since switching and Weir must see something that he figures will work), then it doesn't matter how odd or unorthodox some might think it looks.
It does prove one thing: there is no single "right way" to hit a golf ball.
However, it emphasizes another point: it is very easy to become confused with swing theories.
Since there is no single correct way to hit a golf ball, pick one method and work with it.
Trying different swing approaches, whether it's the One-Plane theory, the Swing Machine Golf method that I use (or try to...) or this new Stack and Tilt swing, will simply mess up most of us amateurs.
We are constantly looking for the One Great Truth that will finally work. What we end up with might just be Fool's Gold.
Permalink: Stack and Tilt: Fool's Gold?
Tags: golf swing swing theory one plane swing mike bennett andy plummer 2007 stack+tilt
Vote for Stack and Tilt: Fool's Gold?:
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Rating: 6.58 out of 24 vote(s) cast.
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Response from:
Ken
(05/17/07 6:04pm)
Laugh if you want, but it works. I am a former 5 handicapper who had rotator cuff surgery and now have an 8. I am 65 years old and have been plagued for years with weak "slap" shots that I have managed to learn how to score with. But man, let me tell you I have added 10-15 yards of laser-like yards onto my irons and a feeling of solid striking like I have never felt in my years of golfing. Today I actually hit a drive 253 yards - - not bad for 130 lbs. and 5'7" and 65, even if I do say so myself. This swing works. It's much easier and very effective.
Response from:
Peter
(05/21/07 2:10pm)
I took some time to try out the Stack and Tilt and have hit maybe 200 to 250 balls using all my clubs. I was hitting pretty respectably before but I have added 10 to 15 metres to most of the irons with a firmer, crisper strike on almost every shot. For example with my 6 iron I've gone from 135 metres to closer to 150 metres. My fairway woods are generally dead straight but probably not much longer than before. For driver I had to tee the ball down about 2.5 cm lower, but that is the only adjustment and it is making 215 to 225 metres reliably. I think the description of leaning left is not well described in the Golf Digest article. I quickly realised that the lean to the left, at the top of the backswing is actually towards the ball not towards the target as they describe. Think of your left side - draw a line along the outside of your left leg up your body at address and with this method it is fairly straight. But as your body turns in the back swing, to maintain the spine tilt over the ball, your body has to lean to the left towards the ball (not the target) at the top of the backswing. The photo they show of the two stretching exercises is misleading in that regard - instead of feet hips and shoulders all being in line as he leans left, he should have his feet in line to the target and hips and shoulders turned as he leans left - that would give you a clearer picture of what you need to achieve at the top of the backswing.
Response from:
Drayton
(06/07/07 12:53am)
Look at all the blog sites 90% or better are for this swing. I've already gained 50 yards back at 60years old i'm hitting my driver 290 yards and my irons are more crisp land better and roll less. I score this swing a 10 out of 10.
Response from:
Dave
(06/28/07 12:57am)
My 2 cents: S&T works. I am a rookie, no formal training, and basically suck, inconsistent, and am mostly annoyed at myself as I play. I've converted from softball to golf, and it hasn't been easy.
Anyway, a buddy turned me on to S&T a few days back. All of the sudden I can play. I'm stunned by the simplicity of the swing. It seemed so complicated and disjointed before. Now, it's simple. S&T is uncomplicated. You just stay over that ball on your left side and smash it. For a new golfer, this approach is so much more natural and actually works. For the first time ever, I've actually hit my irons the distance the should go, like over 170 on my 5i. Oh and btw, they are going straight. I've never felt the thwack that I've seen other golfers do, and the accompanying sailing of the ball. Often I've thought, and even said out loud that I would pay to have that swing. Well, I'm finally doing it, and it feels great! 2 days after being introduced, I'm good. Sold. Thanks to the instructors, certainly it's a "revolution" for me.
Anyway, a buddy turned me on to S&T a few days back. All of the sudden I can play. I'm stunned by the simplicity of the swing. It seemed so complicated and disjointed before. Now, it's simple. S&T is uncomplicated. You just stay over that ball on your left side and smash it. For a new golfer, this approach is so much more natural and actually works. For the first time ever, I've actually hit my irons the distance the should go, like over 170 on my 5i. Oh and btw, they are going straight. I've never felt the thwack that I've seen other golfers do, and the accompanying sailing of the ball. Often I've thought, and even said out loud that I would pay to have that swing. Well, I'm finally doing it, and it feels great! 2 days after being introduced, I'm good. Sold. Thanks to the instructors, certainly it's a "revolution" for me.
Response from:
Gary
(06/30/07 5:47pm)
I'm 58 with a bad left rotator. This swing allows me to hit the ball the same distances I did 15 years ago. I'm sold and it only took a short time to learn. For those who are struggling with a sway, try it!
Response from:
Dade
(07/17/07 6:06pm)
I was playing to a 3 handicap and have never had an issue with power, but was no longer able to play 2 to 3 times per week and was losing my ball striking ability. I always felt I needed the clubs in my hands several times per week to use the 2 pivot swing (whether one plan or two) and even then I'd still go through mini-slumps. I began using the concept of staying centered over the ball and from the first time a the range, my ball striking GREATLY improved! My average 7 iron before was 180 yards, but inconsitent in direction - sometimes a draw, sometimes a fade and sometimes much worse. I'm the same distance now and my accuracy has greatly increased and I dont feel the need to manipulate my hands to release the club, the release is so natural and my club path is much more consistent! I LOVE IT!!!!
Response from:
David
(07/24/07 12:48am)
My average score was eighty, for ten years, give or take a stroke, began using the Stack and Tilt, for thirty days, now shoot two or three over par, on a regular basis. it is just a simple move, it is almost boring, except for the crispness of my shots, I feel myself making mistakes in execution, but still end up with a reasonable good shot.
I checked out Jack in his first instruction book,
a chunky twenty year old, he certainly stayed centered over the ball. If I recall correctly, he appeared to spin back and then spin forward on the same axis.
I can see this type swing helping weekend golfers enjoy themselves more.
In my opinion, after trying the stack and tilt, only a massachist
would use a two pivot swing.
kind regards david
I checked out Jack in his first instruction book,
a chunky twenty year old, he certainly stayed centered over the ball. If I recall correctly, he appeared to spin back and then spin forward on the same axis.
I can see this type swing helping weekend golfers enjoy themselves more.
In my opinion, after trying the stack and tilt, only a massachist
would use a two pivot swing.
kind regards david
Response from:
Mark
(08/03/07 1:19am)
This method does two things - it keeps the club face extremely square thought the impact area, and it promotes a very easy release. These things usually requite tons of range work and the use of swing aids. I got the feel of Stack and Tilt after one bucket of balls. The main difference is I was way more confident standing over the ball whic also improves the results. It will require recalibrating the club distances. For the mid- to long-irons, it immediately adds about 10 yards.
Response from:
steve
(08/30/07 4:49pm)
Ever since Ledbetter and a couple of lessons in Atlanta I have been struggling with two problems: coming over the top and lower back pain. Since stack and tilt in June, I have resolved both and lowered my handicap from 7 to 4. Now if there was only something to help me get up and down, even though I need to less often.
Response from:
Phill
(09/02/07 3:38pm)
I have been playing golf for 15yrs and managed to grind my handicap down to 8 using a "traditional" swing. Distance was fine but consistency was non exsistent. One day I would shoot a 76 next day for no reason a 90. Since changing to the stack and tilt i cant stop smiling its so easy it should be illegal! every shot i hit is like a bullet straight and long. Within weeks i'll be down to a 4 or 5 handicap using it.
Response from:
Mark
(10/16/07 12:40pm)
Stack and tilt is a poor term for what is really happening here. The arms orbit around a fixed axis point. From Hogan to Snead to every great ballstriker. Do poor ball strikers win, sure they do. That is an entirely different discussion. This is science, I don't see how it is debateable. It is the easiest way to hit a golf ball assuming your body works.
Response from:
Graham
(10/25/07 3:03am)
I was a 13 handicap of 50 years old who only started playing golf 5 years ago. The biggest problem I had was the weight transfer to the right hand side and continously ended up playing off the back foot and hooking the ball. I just could not get the weight across to the front foot. Stack and tilt has corrected that as there is now no way you cannot be on the front foot on connection with the ball. My handicap? After 2 months I am down to an 11 and dropping fast as I am regularly playing to what should be a 6 or 7 handicap and improving all the time.
Response from:
Gene
(07/08/08 2:43pm)
For those of you who have tried the Stack & Tilt with the limited data we have been able to acquire from the posts, YouTube videos and the infamous Golf Digest article you might finally be glad to know that there is now available a DVD release of the actual instructional from Medicus Golf. It features Mike & Andy and they teach you in great detail how to master the swing with ease.
I have recently started the 4 Disc series and even though I am only ½ way through the program, the results are mind blowing! The technique HANDS DOWN works!!
If anyone would like to get more info on the actual DVD set I’ve included the link here for reference – http://www.medicuscorporate.com
I think this finally gives everyone the opportunity to get the real facts on how this Swing works and if its right for you. I think most golfers will find the Stack & Tilt an effective way to improve their game as I have.
I have recently started the 4 Disc series and even though I am only ½ way through the program, the results are mind blowing! The technique HANDS DOWN works!!
If anyone would like to get more info on the actual DVD set I’ve included the link here for reference – http://www.medicuscorporate.com
I think this finally gives everyone the opportunity to get the real facts on how this Swing works and if its right for you. I think most golfers will find the Stack & Tilt an effective way to improve their game as I have.
Response from:
Tom Kay
(08/24/08 7:36am)
Went to the range to try S & T method after a few tries I flushed my 5 iron off the grass 3 times in a row. Can't remember the last time I did that.
Response from:
Larry
(09/23/08 8:55am)
@Tom Kay: Would be interested to know if you are still flushing your irons or if it was a one time effect.
Response from:
Ewald
(04/19/09 5:51am)
I'm 62 years of age - hell! I hate to admit it. I've been playing golf for 37 years with the lowest handicap being 4. So I could safely say that I've been around on the golf course. I eventually bacame to frustrated with the game that I stopped playing for some three years. The reason? I believe that one should be able to hit a reasonable golf shot consistantly after 37 years of practic! Not so? I put my bad golf swing down to old age, but still could not face that fact that I could hit one decent shot and the very next shot would be fat or thin or slice or hook. Very frustrating! Golf is supposed to be enjoyable, not agony.
I searched for some miracle on the Net. First came up the "Kung Fu Golf Swing" by Andrew Barker. The author claims that this swing will increase one's length off the tee, but it is not as simple as that. The swing is still based on the traditional movement of weight from side to side. This is exactly what caused someone like me to hit fat shots and thereby losing much distance. The shifting of the weight and back before striking the ball, is extremely critical. If one does not get this exactly right, the resulting shot is dissapointing.
Enough of that.
Then I went back to Google and found the "stack and tilt" swing. I've tried this swing for only one round of golf and was extremely surprised by the simplicity and the results. First up, it reminds one of the right way to chip: ie. with the weight off the front foot. Chipping of the front foot will always cause a criper shot because the angle of attack on the ball is some much steeper. With the "stack and tilt" swing exactly the same happens. The back swing is shortened without realising it (I suffered from a too long a back swing). The shots are much crisper. I hit the ball much straighter and I'm not compromising on any distance! I've gone one step further, though: I changed my normal Vardon grip to a straight forward hammer grip. This gives me much more leverage on the down swing and I can actually hit the ball harder just before impact. For the first time in 37 years, I feel "in control" of my swing. I can even work the ball with slight draws and fades at will.
If I had discovered this swing 37 years ago, I could even have played pro golf - but now I'm too old even for the Seniors' tour.
I therefore cannot agree with the mindset ot the stack and tilt golfswing as being "Fool's Gold". The swing will improve all golfers game - especially beginners who just "love to sway with Danny Kay"
I searched for some miracle on the Net. First came up the "Kung Fu Golf Swing" by Andrew Barker. The author claims that this swing will increase one's length off the tee, but it is not as simple as that. The swing is still based on the traditional movement of weight from side to side. This is exactly what caused someone like me to hit fat shots and thereby losing much distance. The shifting of the weight and back before striking the ball, is extremely critical. If one does not get this exactly right, the resulting shot is dissapointing.
Enough of that.
Then I went back to Google and found the "stack and tilt" swing. I've tried this swing for only one round of golf and was extremely surprised by the simplicity and the results. First up, it reminds one of the right way to chip: ie. with the weight off the front foot. Chipping of the front foot will always cause a criper shot because the angle of attack on the ball is some much steeper. With the "stack and tilt" swing exactly the same happens. The back swing is shortened without realising it (I suffered from a too long a back swing). The shots are much crisper. I hit the ball much straighter and I'm not compromising on any distance! I've gone one step further, though: I changed my normal Vardon grip to a straight forward hammer grip. This gives me much more leverage on the down swing and I can actually hit the ball harder just before impact. For the first time in 37 years, I feel "in control" of my swing. I can even work the ball with slight draws and fades at will.
If I had discovered this swing 37 years ago, I could even have played pro golf - but now I'm too old even for the Seniors' tour.
I therefore cannot agree with the mindset ot the stack and tilt golfswing as being "Fool's Gold". The swing will improve all golfers game - especially beginners who just "love to sway with Danny Kay"
Response from:
Chris Henry
(04/19/09 11:45am)
Ewald, yours is surely the most eloquent of the many comments left on this post.
Response from:
Nidus
(04/20/09 6:34am)
Like Ewald I'm also now playing all my golf shots with the weight on the front foot. Was already doing it with chipping , pitching and bunker shots and now playing full shots with weight on the front foot also naturally follows.
I'm just amazed at how simple it has been to adopt. Just tried a few shots on the range with the weight largely on my front foot throughout the swing then was able to go straight to the course and started doing it there with amazing results. Dont even have to think about all the other bits like tilt etc.
I'm just amazed at how simple it has been to adopt. Just tried a few shots on the range with the weight largely on my front foot throughout the swing then was able to go straight to the course and started doing it there with amazing results. Dont even have to think about all the other bits like tilt etc.
Response from:
Bryon
(04/23/09 11:37am)
I'm a 15 handicapper looking for more consistency with my irons. I haven't practiced the S&T yet, but I am excited about how much it will improve my game. I always have chipped and pitched well, mostly because I keep my weight left and make a shorter backswing. It only makes sense that it works with long irons too. I can't wait to play again and try this swing!
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