Stack and Tilt: Teaching Pros Chime In
Filed in archive Golf Instruction on May 16, 2007
One Last Time: Bennett and Plummer Flanking Baddeley
Courtesy: Golf Digest
I have heard from three different "swing doctors" regarding the new Stack and Tilt golf swing that is the subject of a major story in the June issue of Golf Digest.
Mike at GolfTipsForU.com posted a comment which I think might sum up the problems amateurs will have trying to emulate Aaron Baddeley and other pros who use the swing developed by Mike Bennett and Andy Plummer.
Mike said, and I quote, "...it worked really well with my irons but I couldn't hit my driver to save my life".
Since the predominant downswing in Stack and Tilt is steeply down onto the ball, it's no wonder Mike could hit his irons crisply.
But the driver calls for a sweeping motion upward, as I have been taught, and I don't know how that's possible with Bennett and Plummer's swing.
Paul Wilson, creator of Swing Machine Golf which emulates Iron Byron, was very succinct when I asked him to comment.
"I don't see how it relates back to Iron Byron", was all Paul would offer. Let's remember that, for many years, Iron Byron was the robot used by the USGA and various equipment manufacturers to test balls and clubs.
Iron Byron was used because it produced the perfect golf swing. Stack and Tilt looks nothing like Iron Byron.
The most detailed reply to my queries came from Roger Fredericks whose DVD instructional series, "Roger Fredericks Reveals Secrets To Golf Swing Flexibility" is apparently the best-selling golf DVD on the planet at the moment.
In addition to being a swing coach to many top name touring pros, Roger is also an expert on the physiology of the golf swing and what it does to the human body.
Roger told me that he has seen Bennett and Plummer working with Steve Elkington who also uses the Stack and Tilt swing method.
He is detailed and precise in his thoughts.
"First off, there are a LOT of ways to swing a golf club effectively, and
there are a few great players that played that way. The truth is:
"anatomically" the method of keeping the head still is against the law of
the body's design and function. That doesn't mean that it can't work. The
human body is a 2 pivot axis machine because we have two hip joints on which
the muscles support the weight bilaterally. Staying primarily on the left
side forces the muscles to compensate and place more load bear pressure and
torque on the body - primarily the lower back. If you look at the majority
of great players throughout history who kept their head still and swung that
way, most of them ended up with back problems - Nicklaus, Couples, Palmer,
etc. Moving the weight of the body into the right hip takes the load bear
pressure off of the spine and gets the body moving naturally and freely.
Another negative to that technique is that a player will not achieve proper
"segmental velocity" (that is the rhythm of the weight shift back and
forth). Imagine a baseball pitcher that didn't rock into a windup, but
rather just stayed on his front foot. He simply won't be as fluid in his
motion as a player who flows with gravity. They also made a statement in
that [Golf Digest] article where they pointed out that Nicklaus "supposedly" kept all of
his weight on his left foot. That's simply not true. In fact, I gave a
seminar at the World Golf Fitness Summit two weeks ago, where I showed
videos of how Nicklaus lifted his left foot off the ground higher than
anybody that I've ever seen. I've worked with Jack, and he's told me that
lifting that foot too high was one of his problems! How did he load his
right hip so deep - lift his foot very high off the ground and still keep
all of his weight on it?
Now, having said that, there are some definite positives:
Keeping more still and over the ball, will create less Center of Gravity
fluctuation. In layman's terms, there is much less margin of error. High
handicappers have way too much movement in their swings (usually because
they are not flexible enough), and therefore end up with too much activity
going on. This method will eliminate a lot of excessive and unnecessary
movement that the higher handicapper doesn't need.
In summary, I feel that golfers who are anatomically functional should allow their bodies
to shift their weight the way that nature intended them to, and for higher
handicappers to incorporate more stillness."
End of story? Probably not. I'm sure we'll be hearing from Bennett and Plummer refuting the charges that their swing is a non-starter.
In the meantime, I'll stick with my swing - which, for what it's worth, has gone completely south...

there are a few great players that played that way. The truth is:
"anatomically" the method of keeping the head still is against the law of
the body's design and function. That doesn't mean that it can't work. The
human body is a 2 pivot axis machine because we have two hip joints on which
the muscles support the weight bilaterally. Staying primarily on the left
side forces the muscles to compensate and place more load bear pressure and
torque on the body - primarily the lower back. If you look at the majority
of great players throughout history who kept their head still and swung that
way, most of them ended up with back problems - Nicklaus, Couples, Palmer,
etc. Moving the weight of the body into the right hip takes the load bear
pressure off of the spine and gets the body moving naturally and freely.
Another negative to that technique is that a player will not achieve proper
"segmental velocity" (that is the rhythm of the weight shift back and
forth). Imagine a baseball pitcher that didn't rock into a windup, but
rather just stayed on his front foot. He simply won't be as fluid in his
motion as a player who flows with gravity. They also made a statement in
that [Golf Digest] article where they pointed out that Nicklaus "supposedly" kept all of
his weight on his left foot. That's simply not true. In fact, I gave a
seminar at the World Golf Fitness Summit two weeks ago, where I showed
videos of how Nicklaus lifted his left foot off the ground higher than
anybody that I've ever seen. I've worked with Jack, and he's told me that
lifting that foot too high was one of his problems! How did he load his
right hip so deep - lift his foot very high off the ground and still keep
all of his weight on it?
Now, having said that, there are some definite positives:
Keeping more still and over the ball, will create less Center of Gravity
fluctuation. In layman's terms, there is much less margin of error. High
handicappers have way too much movement in their swings (usually because
they are not flexible enough), and therefore end up with too much activity
going on. This method will eliminate a lot of excessive and unnecessary
movement that the higher handicapper doesn't need.
In summary, I feel that golfers who are anatomically functional should allow their bodies
to shift their weight the way that nature intended them to, and for higher
handicappers to incorporate more stillness."
Permalink: Stack and Tilt: Teaching Pros Chime In
Tags: golf digest stack and tilt mike bennett andy plummer roger fredericks swing machine golf pros stack+
Vote for Stack and Tilt: Teaching Pros Chime In:
|
Rating: 5.11 out of 9 vote(s) cast.
|
Response from:
George Finley
(05/21/07 9:07am)
I've been studying golf for many years and have tried everything that I could learn to hit the ball straighter and crisper. The stack and tilt is the most efficient way by my book. If you study Ben Hogan carefully, this is his swing for sure. He described his swing differently than it really was. He set up over the ball, his left knee started toward the target line in front of the ball, his right knee straightened and at the top you could see no "tilt" in his spine. Study it and you too will see. As for back problems--none! This is the perfect way to hit a golf ball and it is as old as golf. All the old players straightened their right leg and stayed over the ball. I vote yes on the "Stack and Tilt"! geo
Response from:
John
(05/22/07 11:36pm)
Rick Hendershot wrote quite a nice article on the swing at http://www.articlegold.com/Article/Understanding-the--Stack-and-Tilt--
Golf-Swing/5359
Golf-Swing/5359
Response from:
Ken
(06/09/07 2:43pm)
I've tried the stacked & tilt swing and like it. I'm a 14 hcp. because of my course management and short game, not my swing. I ,and most higher handicappers, don't get to our left side on contact. This method is great for that. I've had lessons and tried different methods, nothing gets me to my left side like this. Nothing. With your weight starting on your left foot and then pushing down to start the downswing, it automatically brings you up and on your left foot at impact. I've hit more greens in reg.and more solid shots then ever before. And it's simple, no 8 steps to better golf with 10 components in each step. For ordinary golfers this is the way to go. Let the teaching pros confuse the better players. I believe in KISS, keep it simple stupid.
Response from:
Edward
(06/17/07 11:24am)
I'm not a pro. Can't even say I'm a weekend golfer... which is why I love this swing method so much. I don't have time to "learn" my swing every time I go out to play. My old swing was too hard to "find", much less, keep. By the time I reached the 16th hole... I finally found it. Too late! This swing is so easy to practice, "and find", right before a round. I am sold!!
Response from:
Brad
(07/25/07 6:53am)
I'm a 52 yo 4 handicapper and can honestly say this is the best swing method I have seen in 35 years of golf. Only need to think of 2 moves....tilt towards the target going back, then "stand up" in the downswing...simple!! I'm sure it won't be long before I get back down to a 2 hcp.
Response from:
zack
(07/27/07 5:31pm)
I started playing golf a few years ago when I started cutting greens. I would work a little bit and then play golf all day. I had alot of trouble hitting long irons. After a while i developed a swing where i put the ball very far forward in my stance, and stayed on my left foot. I hit the ball a long way, but when i started to swing like this I could tee off with a 3 iron, and sting it out there about 230-250. It's also very easy to shape when you don't have to worry about timing as much IT'S GREAT!!!
Response from:
Jessie Melton
(04/14/08 12:39am)
Let me say this about stack and tilt...When I first taught myself to play I did so by trial and error. My basis for golf began with a video by Arnold Palmer which gave me a good baseline. I evolved to the stack and tilt as a consistent way of striking and hitting solid shots...this was in the mid-late 1990s before I ever heard of this new name swing. Before I fine tuned my version of the stack and tilt I was talked out of it by other golfers because I would sometime lean backwards towards the target. I am going back to it because it gives me, a tall guy with very long legs a base that does not shift which causes other problems. It may not be for everyone, but for tall guys I think it helps with providing a stable base. The one key that I teach and is a must for this swing is that a shortened back swing keeps you on line and on plane much better. So go ahead..Stack & tilt your way to better scores...at least give it a try...it is very similar to a solid wedge swing...weight on front foot and keep it there....I am a single digit handicapper that has gotten tired of the frustration of the weight transfer. I am going back to the stack and tilt and back to scratch
Response from:
Chris
(04/14/08 10:12am)
Gentlemen - Thank you! Your responses are the surest indication that Stack and Tilt is a bonafide swing technique and not some flash-in-the-pan gimmick. Golfers have found another path to God!!
Response from:
Mark
(04/14/08 2:11pm)
It seems that there is many a trail that can lead to our wanted destination. Finding the one that best suits our mind is the key.
Response from:
john
(09/16/08 11:35pm)
Actually, Iron Byron is more like the Stack and Tilt swing than the conventional one for this reason...Iron Byron does not transfer weight to it's "right" side then to it's left. It is stationary like the S&T swing. I've played and studied and taken lessons and practiced my tail off to be a better ball striker. I've had marginal success (about 8 greens per round in regulation, historically). The Stack and Tilt has been a miracle for me. I now hit on the average 12-14 greens (last 9 hole round I hit 8 of 9). My ball striking is solid, dead straight and for the first time in my life I'm hitting the ball first and the target side of the ground second. I've also picked up 1 1/2 clubs in distance. All of the guys I've played with the last 15 years are blown away by the distance and accuracy of my irons. I shallow my swing a little with my driver and woods and the results are super. This has been the greatest thing to happen to my game EVER!!! Thank you Andy and Mike!
Response from:
Greg
(03/18/09 9:19am)
I am in my 5th month of stack and tilt lessons. I am amused when I see Golf swing "authorities" comment negatively on the stack and tilt because it flies in the face of there "methodology" Comments about not being possible to hit driver with such a steep downswing and "back problems" caused by stack and tilt are false! The first thing stack and tilt did was cure my golf swing related back pain. I am a chiropractor and know that spinal extension (S&T)is more mechanically correct and healthier than forward flexion (traditional) for most people. As far as the "driver" comment, get real. You're going to tell me that the 20+ PGA tour pro's now using the stack and tilt ( and winning with it) can't drive the golf ball? Gimme a break..!!!
Response from:
Donaldo
(12/28/09 6:14am)
For Christmas I tried stack/tilt on my basement golf course, old thin carpets w net at far end. Drop a ball, rip a bullseye (pinned up paper plates) on every shot. Many with no practice swing. Then dropped balls on my putting greens and picked them clean too. OK, I figured that maybe SnT works bc tennis is my sport - it fits the swing motion - but after reading these comments, it's obvious that SnT just plain works! There's something powerful about bearing down on the shot; you just know that good contact is coming on every down swing.
| RSS | |
|
| |
| Yahoo! |
|
| Addthis |
|
| Bloglines |
|
| Follow us on Twitter! |
Most Popular
Best of
Did you know
European Tour
Golf Business
Golf Courses
Golf Equipment
Golf Fitness
Golf Humor
Golf Instruction
Golf Interviews
Golf News
Golf Travel
Golf Wanderings
Information About
Misc
Quick introduction
US Open
